The Keri Croft Show
The Keri Croft Show
From Logistics to Laundry: Starting Over and Scaling Big with Michael Flinner from The Fluff
Michael Flinner spent 17 years building a successful logistics company—only to walk away and start from scratch with something completely different: The Fluff, a premium pickup-and-delivery laundry service in Central Ohio.
We get into the unsexy realities of building something sustainable, why convenience is the new currency, and the importance of staying “in the mud” when you’re laying the foundation of a business. We talk pricing psychology, narrowing your audience, and how to keep climbing new mountains without burning out.
And somewhere along the way, Michael turned the tables and started asking me the questions—which got me a little fired up (in the best way).
If you’re an entrepreneur in the dreaming stage, stuck in the messy middle, or staring down the next big climb, this one’s packed with perspective, strategy, and a few laughs.
#TheKeriCroftShow #TheFluff #PodcastNowLive #EntrepreneurLife #ColumbusOhio
Hey there you beautiful badass. Welcome to the Keri Croft Show. I'm your host, keri Croft, delivering you stories that get you pumped up and feeling like the unstoppable savage that you are. So grab your coffee, put on your game face and let's do this thing, baby. Face and let's do this thing, baby.
Speaker 2:Avena Women's Care is a collective of 40 plus providers that have been serving central Ohio communities with comprehensive women's health care for decades. They meet women where they are, in every phase of life. From fertility services to menopause care, annual checkups to 3D mammography. Avena provides robust services for all. So for the highest level of individualized women's health care, there's one name to remember Avena Women's Care. Go to wwwavenawomenscarecom to request an appointment. Be sure to tell them. Carrie sent you Ready to elevate your self-care game.
Speaker 2:Bosco Beauty Bar is a modern med spa offering everything from cosmetic injectables, lasers and microneedling to medical-grade facials and skin care, conveniently located in Clintonville, grandview, powell and Easton. Making self-care a priority has never been easier. Use code KROFT for $25 off your first visit. Summer's coming in hot, but is your skin summer ready? Fine lines, sun damage, melasma If these are cramping your vibe, the Moxie Laser at Donaldson will leave you glowing. Nervous about lasering your face. I tried Moxie and it was quick and gentle, perfect for first-timers and all skin types. And my results 10 out of 10. And if you're a first timer at Donaldson, mention the Keri Croft Show for $100 off your Moxie treatment. Don't say I've never done anything for you.
Speaker 3:Can I possibly get water?
Speaker 2:No, we do not. That's fine what we like here. We like your throat to get really dry.
Speaker 3:I saw a beer in there, we like people to cry. We like you to sweat Do you want a beer, I could probably do both. No, I'll do La Croix would be perfect, are?
Speaker 2:we out of poppy? I don't even like poppy. Can I have a La Croix?
Speaker 3:I decided I don't.
Speaker 2:I cracked one open at my house and I was like this doesn't even taste good. Or maybe I'm just mad at her because she sold her company for a billion dollars and she's hot and like whatever sponsored by yeah, why am I?
Speaker 3:giving them. Maybe they'll sponsor us, you never know michael flinner, my friend.
Speaker 2:Welcome to the kerry cross show kc.
Speaker 3:I'm excited, I'm excited. Thanks for having me thanks for being here.
Speaker 2:so did you always know you had mentioned to me when I put that picture up of myself when I was six, you sent me a dm and you're like, oh my God, same.
Speaker 3:So you knew from a very young age about that age, six or seven years old, and we had a like a spare bedroom at my parents' house. That was like a toy room and I'm the youngest of three. So as we got older it just became kind of a whatever hangout room and I remember in the summers or maybe even after school, but there was a card table in there and I would set it up and have paper on there. You know, to go out and like, find paper and books from the living room, bring it in and have pencils and pens and everything all lined up and I would pull an old 1980s metal chair in there and sit behind this card table and I would just be a boss. I had no clue what that meant, but I was pretending that I was running this company.
Speaker 3:So I don't know that I was exactly entrepreneur in that way, but it was like that business mindset, I think, from the early stages of it. And then I think, yeah, through the course of probably high school and college, you kind of start putting your head on a swivel like, well, how did that person I was always intrigued by, because I come from a very small town, I was always intrigued by the quote unquote successful business person who created the business, who created something from scratch. Um, and then, as I got older, it really blew my mind Like wait, that never existed, like they had this aha moment one day and they started dreaming and then, you know, work their butt off, and so so what was your first business and your first aha moment?
Speaker 3:first business and your first aha moment. Well, like every kid washing cars, mowing lawns and um, but I think that kind of led into you know I had other ideas I just never followed through with because I thought I was supposed to go to college.
Speaker 3:I was supposed to, you know, be living society's view of what the path was, and I think that's something that's very freeing for, like, a lot of entrepreneurs is like, our path is not like everybody else's, and so when we realize that, you know, it can be very lonely and isolating to think that, well, I don't think like my friends at that early, you know, and if you're 22, 23 years old and you're like, or even younger, like 18, 19, going into college, you're like, well, this isn't for for me, I'm a college dropout, so that's why I said that, and so it took a few years, and even into, you know, probably into my mid to late 20s till I was like wait a second, like it's okay, I think different and, um, so yeah, that's when I launched my first company.
Speaker 3:I was 26.
Speaker 2:And in what industry?
Speaker 3:In logistics, transportation and uh logistics.
Speaker 2:Were you passionate about making money? Was that it? Was it like? That was the like? I can't imagine you being like I'm so passionate about transportation and logistics, but was that it Like? I'm going to build this empire? We are going to build this empire, and is that what kind of drove you Like? You're like, yes, we're going to make money.
Speaker 3:I think when you're that young, you don't really know why exactly.
Speaker 3:You just uh, it seems exciting to I mean you know why? Because it's the biggest thing was like being on my own, creating something on my own, and you know, it can be that old adage of like be my own boss and wake up and do what I want to do every day. Well, you quickly learn yeah, you or, I guess, your own boss, but you wear a lot of hats in the beginning and I think once I got into it, I realized that I loved looking at all these industries that we served and wondering how they started. I was just so curious. And that's when, like full entrepreneur kicks in, right Of like wow, I got to see 10 different companies this week and how they, you know, ship their products and it just blew my mind how they were all different. They're all started somewhere third, fourth generation, summer, first generation. But I thought it was really neat how, you know, everyone started with the same dream and took a huge risk, and so I just getting to learn you know more about the customer base we had.
Speaker 2:So you were doing this logistics thing for like 17 years. You decided you're done thing. For like 17 years you decided you're done and now you're doing the fluff, which is completely different. It's laundry service. So walk us through the thought process that you had in terms of okay, I just had the, I did this for 17 years. I'm going to do something different. Like, what kind of ideation did you go through? How long did it take? What made you decide to land on doing laundry for people?
Speaker 3:Yeah, I just it was time for me to move on and try something new, right, to get creative again and look to something new.
Speaker 3:And I was on YouTube one night and you know I've talked about Cody Sanchez and she's a beast and she had put an investment into a laundry company in Austin, texas called the Fold and I've always thought, quote unquote, passive income industries were interesting, right, laundry companies, laundromats, car washes Until you get in them, and I don't think anything is truly passive. But this was different, where they really shined on the pickup and delivery aspect and again it goes back to like truly serving the customer, making their lives easier. I was like I'm in, so I watched this. I probably watched that YouTube video 18 times in like a week because I would pause and they would show financials, I would zoom in OK, how does this work? And I would Google the owners and figure out how they were doing things. And there was a few other articles and as time went on, there was more press releases on them and you know they, they grew really fast and ultra successful and Mark Blastkamp is one of the entrepreneurs that started that.
Speaker 3:And finally, I think it's like anything else you know you talked about at the beginning of like people with these crazy ideas in their head and there's four seasons and that's the first one. I call it right. It's the dreaming season, when it won't leave you alone. I think you're supposed to, and you can call it God, the universe, wherever you want, but there's always a tap on your shoulder.
Speaker 3:Every so often you look over, and for me it was like I could be traveling to a city and walking down a sidewalk in Florida and there was a pickup and delivery van. I'm like, am I supposed to do this? Right, like? I have a dozen examples like that and I think when you hear that whisper over and over again, it's just it's time to act on it. And for me it was. It was a little hard to go back to the beginning, right Cause, as you remember those days, the first time, the first couple of times, maybe and um, it can be and it can be painful, but what I've realized now in my 40s is it's kind of what we make it and kind of, you know, I enjoy it more, I take it slower. What are some of these things teaching me, versus just muscling and powering through and not really looking at the bigger picture?
Speaker 2:Was part of you like holy shit, like like so I've spent 17 years building something. I'm walking away. But now I'm looking at this other mountain and I'm getting like I have to start the climb all over again. But isn't that part of the like allure, in a way? If you know part of you's like, ah, damn, I have to climb this mountain again, you know, starting at ground zero. But then the other part of you's like, oh, I'm gonna climb this, and now I'm not starting at ground zero. But then the other part of you is like, ooh, I'm going to climb this, and now I'm not sharing this with anyone. Now, this is all mine, not in terms of money or greed, but in terms of just the whole experience. You know, because I think owning a company with a partner I don't care what anyone says, I've been there it's just different. So to have the opportunity to then climb this mountain on your own, I don't know, there's a lot of freedom. It's also very scary.
Speaker 3:It is kind of a sick and twisted way that we think about it. Right, like wait a second, I'm going to go back up that mountain, but it's so fun. And the same aspect of how did you word it one day and I think I DM'd you back like I'm going to see how I put this puzzle together or something like that. And it is, it's, it's a, it's. It's fun when you, when you make it fun, I guess if that makes sense, and but that was hard, right, like I, I know what that mountain looks like. I was at the top of it, I guess I could say Um wasn't.
Speaker 3:Long after that, I saw a video with David Goggins say, if you find yourself at the top of the mountain, it's fine for you to find a new mountain to climb Right. And so I felt like those words echoed for like weeks and I was like, okay, I got to go go back down and start climbing again. And but you're right, it's, it's new, it's refreshing, it's you know something that I'm creating and building a new team, building new ideas, learning from new mistakes. So yeah, it can be very exciting. I think we also have to remind ourselves that, at least at this phase, this new company is just to give myself and anyone that might be in the same position. Give yourself tons of grace of. I don't care how long you've been in this game. Like you're going to make mistakes, and this is the first time you may be. It's my first business to consumer venture. Right, like all these different things could come into play and just go along with this journey.
Speaker 2:So it's called the Fluff and it's laundry delivery. Where are you doing all the laundry?
Speaker 3:Right now we have partnered up with a facility near campus, centrally located, which is nice close to 71. I wanted to, and I started in a facility before that which was fine. This one has got plenty of room as we grow. We're not going to like take over the place. And then I've really built a good rapport with the owner. He's amazing and so that was big to find a relationship with the owner and find one that wasn't too busy in the hours that we were going to need it and that we were going to also flood the thing. So right now it's working. We're growing pretty fast. So he and I are watching that closely to see you know what step next steps might be. But yeah, it's a. It's a facility right here near campus.
Speaker 2:And you have a delivery truck outside that's wrapped, I mean you're committed.
Speaker 3:Oh yeah.
Speaker 2:You're driving that puppy around all day long.
Speaker 3:All in, yeah.
Speaker 2:So do you deliver it?
Speaker 3:I'm the driver.
Speaker 2:I know you deliver it to Kimmy, but I didn't know she had some special access.
Speaker 3:Yeah, she gets owner access delivered Right. Access yeah, she gets owner access delivered Right. No, so the beginning I'm a firm believer in. You know there's a couple of different ways I could have done this right, like I could have went out and raised a campaign and hired 10 people I didn't really need, and including driver. And I just come from how I started.
Speaker 3:The first, you know, gig was like let's get in the mud, let's see how this thing works. And I got to tell you there's no better way. When you look back a year, three years, five years from now, when all the procedures are in place, that you had to put in like that I'm putting in now makes sense. Right, it's a big trial and error, but you're not going to know unless you're swimming in those waters in the beginning. And so you know, am I going to be driving this van forever? No, but am I having fun with it now? Right, we're shooting content with it and and you know you got to just swallow pride in the ego and be like I'm in and you know, embarrasses my 17 year old daughter when she sees this thing. She goes. I feel like every time you're in it, driving through Bexley, like I see you with my friends in the car. I'm like well, you should wave. Tell them I'll give them a promo code. Right, let's go. Let's get their parents on board.
Speaker 2:I mean, but that's okay. So lesson for an entrepreneur I mean, that's neon light. For me in my mind is if you can't get in on the ground floor and do all the things, what are you even doing?
Speaker 3:Yeah, I spent like three nights ago, you know, single dude on his couch shopping for best price per ounce on soap that's good soap. You know I don't want the cheapest. Yeah, that's what I. Yeah, but you know stuff like that. And you know I've got an awesome team. I've got a couple people inside, you know, doing the wash dry fold, which they're amazing and I'm so lucky to have found them.
Speaker 3:But, yeah, like I'm doing everything else the driving, and we don't have routes set up now, so we're trying to figure that out. And you know, stuff gets dropped in overnight and you got to be able to pivot the next morning. And it's fun. I'm having fun with it, knowing this isn't forever. But how am I gonna? How am I gonna direct and lead and tell future drivers how it's supposed to be done if I'm not in it right? Like we have this motto with Francis and Jasmine, the two awesome team members I had with me and it's I'm going to get T-shirts made with this.
Speaker 3:But the repeat business is built on the folding table and I tell them, like you guys are rock stars, look, boom, this customer came back. Boom, this customer came back. Boom, this customer came back Because the machines wash, dry the clothes, right, but the repeat business is built on that presentation when they open those bags. And so I'm like this is all you guys right, and so that will be the future message to the drivers too. Like nobody wants you know somebody that looks sloppy shirt untucked, in a bad mood, walking in their flower beds, driver, right. But I have to have all these experiences to know and start to build rapport with the customers to know. Like, okay, now I know, when we start hiring drivers, I can kind of set the stage of what's the expectation.
Speaker 2:Well, I think social media glamorizes entrepreneurship and you have so many people who are looking at whatever it is on social media that someone's curated and everybody, of course, like oh yes, I would love that, I would love to own this business or have this glamorous life. I think they forget the millions of steps that it takes to get there and if, like so, you have no choice but to drive the truck, you have no choice but to be on the ground floor, because without you building it, there would be no ground floor. It's like people's perceptions or idea of what it really takes to build something sustainable with heart, and that matters. I mean, you better love it.
Speaker 3:Carrie. I launched in February Very soft launch. I took my daughter on spring break in March and I knew, going into it if this thing works. And here we are in July, that this statement was going to be true. I'm not going to have a vacation for a while and that's okay. I'm okay with that. Right, like I've been blessed to travel and I've done a ton of that, am I going to ever? Yeah, it's going to happen again, but yeah, I'm in this chapter you're right where it's glamorized a lot of what it's really not. And not that it's awful, it's just part of the journey and it's season one, phase one, which can go, and they could be like that for 20 years for some people who just want to be small business owners and they don't want to expand and have other people come in and take over. But for me it's fun for now and you just have to know some of these sacrifices are going to be worth it and it's not forever.
Speaker 2:Okay, michael. So I do feel like laundry service is like if you had a list of things to take off your plate. Whether you're single mom, single dad, married, both of you work, it doesn't matter. Laundry is a pain in the ass, and so I feel like it is right for the picking. You have the fluff, you're doing the laundry service, but I think it's also there's there's hurdles to overcome, right, like it's your laundry. That's a little intimate. Um, people like it to smell a certain way, they want it to like. I just think there's nothing more intimate than like me giving you my laundry. So help me get, help me get over the hump there to like. Why would I decide to let you do it?
Speaker 3:And it's a newer service, so a lot of people quickly adapt to it. Like, this makes sense. I get it, let's go. And for those that don't, I think the the facts of where we're at in today's society with time is. You know we just dropped this on Instagram yesterday or the day before where you know the average load of laundry for for residential machines right Is is is three hours, right, so you wash it and you dry it. Those are usually 40 to 50-minute cycles and then you're going to do the thing everybody hates, right? We're going to act like we're going to get out of the dryer right away. We might let it sit there and have to rerun the dryer, but no, you get out of the dryer and you start folding it, which most people just can't stand. But it's three hours and so that's one load hours, and so you know that's one load, and so you imagine a family of three, four, five people, it's. It's interesting how I get in these conversations. Never thought I'd be talking about this much laundry with people, but like I literally have a conversation with mom and she'll say thank God, you guys are doing this. I spend six hours, seven hours, a week, on laundry. I do it every day for an hour if I keep up with it and if I don't.
Speaker 3:You know we're seeing a lot of people, like a lot of our regular customers, especially this time of year coming off a summer, and you know camps and vacations. I mean they're dumping three and four large bags because it's overwhelming. I mean you know what it is. You're like you get back from a vacation You're like, oh my gosh, like how am I even going to? And so that's our biggest thing is, is it's going to save time?
Speaker 3:And if you and if you can save time and you know most people are intentional with their children like, okay, let's go to the park, let's go on a walk, let's go to the pool, like I don't have to worry about laundry, and you know it's school starting, you know afterschool activities and little kids and you're you know bossing them around town and sports and camps and clubs, and everybody gets home at 10 o'clock and goes, oh, you don't have any clothes, you don't have the shirt you want to wear tomorrow, you don't have the, and for some parents they don't have the uniform right, they need it turned in 24 hours, and so it's just kind of this common theme that I'm noticing with parents and singles too. Right Like I can think of one young professional we have and I've talked to him and he's like I'm traveling all the time. You know, he gives us the access code to his building, we're up, he leaves his bag in the hallway. He's traveling all the time. When he gets back from three, four day work trip and he's got another one in two days he doesn't want to do laundry and so I think it's it's a common theme for both singles and families.
Speaker 3:Is time a?
Speaker 2:common theme for both singles and families is time.
Speaker 3:So prediction from you.
Speaker 2:Where is this at in five years?
Speaker 3:I don't know if I said five years when I'm about to tell you, but my best friend from back home, who loves 90s rap and R&B just as much as you do, I've told you about him. He and I were texting one night and I said something like let's get this bad boy up to 12. I was showing him pictures of the van and I said 12 vans and he said no, you're going to have 50. I was like OK, I don't know about that, but who knows, in five years I don't think it would be out of the question to say I kind of gauge it in delivery vans, because that's how my nerdy math works behind the scenes, because I know how many pickup and deliveries that is. But I think it's several hundred customers. I think it's, yeah, probably 10 to 12 vans and I think we're leaning into another market.
Speaker 2:Oh, okay, so you have all those vans, just for Columbus. Mm-hmm. Okay, leaning into another market in Ohio Makes sense.
Speaker 3:I think the natty would be good. Oh nice, I don't know.
Speaker 2:A lot of dirt, a lot of dirty laundry in the natty, a lot of stuff coming out of the river.
Speaker 3:So what? Let me ask you. So you were in this season of like how long you've had the Keri Croft show A little over two years. What was? Do you remember what the feeling?
Speaker 2:was like going into the very first episode. I think overall it felt very natural because I knew I always had wanted to do a show. Of course you have those little voices in your head of like, what are you doing? You're in your home office, you dumb ass. Who wants to listen to this shit? This is going to. But I think that the enjoyment of it and just really genuinely wanting to sit down with the people that I sat down with, I think that sort of uh was louder than the imposter syndrome you know.
Speaker 3:So that's a great. Next next question is is? I feel like imposter syndrome is talked about a lot. I don't know that entrepreneurs are talking about it enough though.
Speaker 3:I think a lot of people for content are. But that's a good segue into what would you tell a young entrepreneur coming into this Because you're coaching and advising people. A lot of it is like I don't know, Carrie, I've never started it. Most people are like I don't deserve to start a company because I've never started a company before. So I'm like what do you tell people with imposter syndrome? Do it anyway and never expect.
Speaker 2:It's not a thing that goes away. So imposter syndrome, that's like the I don't know this fancy name that we've put on just being a human. It's self-doubt, it's you have the good, the bad. You have things you're great at things that you suck at, and so we all have internal dialogue that goes on that continuum all day long, every day. And so to think that somehow that's going to be something you can take a pill and just cure, you're constantly I don't care who you look at they're constantly doubting themselves in certain ways.
Speaker 2:Now some people have built the muscle the more that you. Here's how I would coach someone is first, you have to have the belief Before you do anything. If I don't believe I can do it, I'm never going to put myself on stage to do it. So I have that internal belief that has to outweigh the internal critic right. So now I believe I believe in myself enough to take that first step and to have that, take that action. What that belief does is it builds my confidence right. So now I'm not even really. I know it, I know I can do it. Now I'm doing it, and now this little muscle is growing as I'm doing it. And the next thing, I know I'm doing it. And now this little muscle is growing as I'm doing it. And the next thing I know I'm super confident.
Speaker 2:And what does confidence do? It builds momentum. So it's belief, confidence, momentum, let's fucking go. And so if you realize that, no one's special that everybody starts in that place of being like I'm a dumbass. But the people who win do it anyway. You fight through it and then guess what happens? Does that voice go away? It probably doesn't. But the belief, the confidence and the momentum are so loud. The people who figure out, in spite of themselves, how to believe, build confidence and get the momentum to go, go and they're consistent with it, those are the ones that are going to win.
Speaker 3:Yeah, because what is it like? 90% of the thoughts we think aren't true anyways, and it's you know, they're all self-deprecating and I think the more you have, then, too, the more you create.
Speaker 2:And this is what I've noticed with my clients, because a lot of people don't have structure, they don't have a system, Like this person that came in last week. Uh, she's a newbie and she's building her brand and her business and she's like well, my, you know, people tell me they're at work, they're like just post. I mean what? A? You know? No one means anything by that. Yeah, Just post.
Speaker 2:But if you don't have, if you don't pull that back and have, like okay, first of all, why, why am I doing any of this? Okay, that's a whole separate conversation. Now you understand that and you're aligned with it. But now you have the whole process and system side, right. So what is your specific infrastructure to not only posting? But how are you marketing? Posting is one pillar of your system. It's one, one small part of the whole, and once people can see that and go, oh wait, I actually have like a, a foundation here and a rhythm. This is how it works. Then you look back at just posts and you're like okay, like what made you want to start that?
Speaker 2:So as I, when I ended my business relationship and I and I, you know, spent 10 amazing years at SOS, just incredible I made myself and that's part of why I started the show where I'm like let's just do something you enjoy, without hooks, without revenue, like let's just do something you enjoy to just kind of bridge whatever is going to happen. And in doing that, it led me to many conversations and just really great authentic moments with people, and so I allow myself to listen and I was like, well, wait, what was I really doing at SOS? Like what really happened there? Right, and what really happened there was I met someone who had this idea that was a total kind of it was like this ball of Christmas lights, you know how it. Like you couldn't even figure out what was going on, right.
Speaker 2:It was just this, very this thing and I saw potential in it. It was a name and a couple of classes and I was in a space I was going through infertility. I wanted something that brought me joy and I love to work out. The rest is history. And so I helped to create the belief, the confidence, the momentum in what became System of Strength, along with my business partner. We did that and I was like that was the most. That was what I enjoyed so much about that process and that's the part I feel like where I I shine. I can help people do that. And then I was like, okay, and so, as I've been doing this show, I created man Eater Media and one thing led to the next and then people are asking me business advice or asking questions and I'm like, well, why am I not making this the thing? And I guess I didn't want.
Speaker 2:I think I was in this ideation phase for so long where it's like you don't want to jump back into a relationship, like when you're in a partnership with a business. It's like a marriage, and so I had a lot to work through just emotionally and just kind of figuring things out. What did I do right, what did I do wrong? You know all that self-reflection stuff, and so I just didn't want to jump into anything. But that's just kept what. It's just what kept happening. You know people are just. You know what questions are people asking you, what are people coming to you for, what are people asking for guidance on? And I'm like, okay, captain, obvious, this is what you should be doing. Right Is helping people build the thing. And so that's when I sat back and just started to design, what I felt like are these entrepreneurial prototypes, and it just kind of all goes into this journey and, as luck would have it, people are. They like it?
Speaker 2:They seem to like it. And so we have, like I said, just have been taking clients and we've soft launched it and I've just really been again in that phase of just enjoying, enjoying it.
Speaker 2:I'm having so much fun, whether it's so we have a product that's called Brand and Build Blueprint and that's like for someone who wants to build their personal brand or if they're going to be doing a solopreneur thing or even with their business. It's like stepping back and really figuring out like how to brand this thing, what are your reasons, what's aligned and then what's the process. So we have like a left side and a right side. The left side is all the ooey gooey, like the alignment and the values and everything, but then you have to take that through some kind of assembly line in order to build something sustainable. So you have that right side. That is then the plumbing and the electric and the systems that you have to have to take that stuff through to really do the thing, you know. So that's one, that's one engagement that has been just like really taking off.
Speaker 2:And then I have a couple of clients right now in the build-out phase, which is they've built something really great. So I've got the Balanced Child Method and she is a really talented entrepreneur and she's ready to scale this thing across the country, and she's ready to scale this thing across the country. And so our philosophy with that is really it's simple in this thing for so long. And you build all these sops and you're, you've got all this stuff everywhere and, as organized as you try to be, you've got duplicity, you've got gaps, you've got all kinds of stuff. So, like liking, it's like a garden. Your garden may have all kinds of weeds and shit and like, so you, and then, when you want to scale, you're in like go mode. Yeah, but the first thing that you should do as a smart entrepreneur is step back and say, ok, current state, what are we doing? Really well, what needs help? So so we like to call it like what needs to be true before we move forward like that.
Speaker 2:And you spend a lot of time there and it's been really cool. So there's like there's six prototypes, and actually there's almost seven now, because there's another one which is like basically burnout and I'm I'm finding these, though, from people, so I didn't just sit down in a in a silo by myself and go, which I could have, because just for my journey I'm I'm basically meeting with people and listening and helping, and then I'm like, oh wait, this is actually a prototype.
Speaker 2:And it's true because this person is sitting here with me, and this is the phase that they're in.
Speaker 3:So you have really prototypes, clients, real-life examples from the dreaming stage to mountaintop burnout and everything in between. Yeah, wow.
Speaker 2:And I will say another thing too that's interesting is there is one that's called blocked, and what's cool, because I've been also very it's been complicated, because I spent 10 years at SOS and there was so much fitness and mindset and you know I'm all about sort of the mindset, and so there's a mixture of mindset and business that goes into the B lab and so there's this person who's blocked and they haven't even really found the idea yet. Where they are is they're kind of miserable self-loathing because they know they can do more, they know that they are meant to do more and they ideate, but they're so stuck in either toxic relationships internally, externally their habits, like they are stuck underneath themselves and they have to get, they have to sort of do some work there before they can really get to like okay, wait, here's my idea. And I see I'm starting to visualize a starting line. So I also have, like from my experience with SOS, sort of these philosophies that I can help people who are blocked. It's like you know, your current version of you versus the ideal, and it's again, it's this bridge and you say okay, let's get real honest about the current version of you, let's do an internal external audit, which is very powerful. You know, an internal audit is basically what the fuck you're doing, but externally is who you're surrounding yourself with, removing the title from whether it's mom, dad, whomever and putting feelings. How do you feel around them? How do they make you? What's the energy right? And then you look at all of that and you put a positive or a negative and you start to look at it and you're like holy shit. Well, no wonder I can't get out of my own way, because between my bucked up habits every day that I'm completely rationalizing, and the external people I'm allowing myself to hang out with, how the fuck am I ever going to get to the starting line to be the best version of me? How am I going to do that? So that person who's blocked needs some mindset work. Right, they need to sift through some of that and I get, as you can tell, very passionate about that. You only walk around. You only get this life once. Really, why aren't you sprinting? Because sometimes people don't even know what they don't know.
Speaker 2:Stress and inflammation take a toll on your body and your wellness. Relax, restore and rejuvenate at Panacea Luxury Spa Boutique. Book any service of $100 or more and enjoy two hours in our luxury amenities. Unwind in our Himalayan salt saunas, recharge in our wet retreat space with a eucalyptus steam room, hot hydrotherapy pool and cold plunge, then drift into deep relaxation with our hanging loungers. What's your panacea? We'll help you find it.
Speaker 2:Listen, nobody loves laundry day, but thanks to the fluff, laundry is officially off your to-do list. Just schedule your pickup on the fluff app. Toss your dirty clothes in any bag you've got and leave it on your front porch. The fluff handles the rest. Returning your laundry fresh, folded and in our reusable vinyl bag in just 24 to 48 hours. Flat rate pricing means you stuff the bag full and, yes, pickup and delivery are totally free. In Central Ohio, use promo code KERRY for 20% off your first order.
Speaker 2:Ps, ask about our monthly subscription to keep life simple and your laundry done. Who says you need a special occasion to feel like a celeb? I mean, stress is real, life is busy and your scalp, yeah, it deserves some love too. That's where Headspace by Mia Santiago comes in. Treat yourself or someone who deserves it to a luxurious scalp treatment and a killer blowout or cut, because nothing says main character, energy, honey, like a fresh style from celebrity stylist Mia and her team, and because we love a good deal, mention the Keri Croft Show and get 20% off your service or any gift card for somebody in your life that you love. Headspace by Mia Santiago.
Speaker 3:Because great hair days shouldn't be rare two things that fall, so you're not telling them, you're really showing them. Yep, that's why it's a lab. Yeah, I love that.
Speaker 2:So what I. So here's another thing, too, that is really I have spent. When I tell you the amount of time in this torture chamber, the only person who knows is the girl to my right and probably my husband, because this isn't about making money Like, okay, of course, do I have goals? I have revenue goals. Do I want to make? Do I want this to be financially successful? Fuck, yes, anyone out there who isn't.
Speaker 2:If that's not one of your pillars, I probably would shake you, but it's one More than that. I want to feel like I'm contributing and making a positive impact in people's lives. And so, at the end of the day, I was like I don't want to do this, like check a box course, or I don't want, and there's no shame, but it always fell flat to me. An interactive like street therapy session meets, business workshop meets we sit down together and look at your shit and real time it. I really want you, michael, when you're done with this, I want you to be a part of the B-Lab community. I want to connect you and network you with people who I really feel like are going to add value. And I want, two years from now, I want to still be connected somehow to you and to know that, like, we have done something really cool.
Speaker 2:You know, it's very important to me that this makes a difference for somebody and so far it's been, and we're still tweaking stuff, right. So these interactions, especially when you're doing like a build out, like so if you're an entrepreneur and you're still tweaking stuff, right. So these interactions, especially when you're doing like a build out, like so if you're an entrepreneur and you're like, you know, I've really thought about opening in a new market or I want to expand, that's not a conversation we're going to have in two hours and then I walk away. Right, I'm not going to give you some canned thing on my agenda. It's more like, hey, let's figure out exactly what this is for you and what would add the most value, and then we sort of map out. But it's very interactive, it's very workshoppy Lab. That's why we call it the lab.
Speaker 3:More intimate and custom.
Speaker 2:And then B, of course, is I mean name it. Name a word, business, build brand, badass, believe, belong brain, body. I mean you could name a million bees that I was like, oh shit. Well, what else could I possibly call this but the bee lab? I love that. Biggie. Biggie. Booyah.
Speaker 3:I think the Cary Crawford is Biggie.
Speaker 2:You know. So I'm excited, I'm really excited about it and I mean we're looking at a mini shark tank here. Potentially. That's. That's too Like when I look at. You know, like you say, with the fluff, like your five year vision or whatever, having a couple leaning into a market and have one of my longer term visions is like they're not all going to align.
Speaker 2:I'm not going to want to invest in everything, but could there be, Could there be someone out there who you know? Maybe we align farther than just a B-Lab engagement, you know? I mean, you never know.
Speaker 3:You never know. You said multiple times and I love this is the best version of themselves. I've really unpacked that a lot in this past two years of my life Because I don't think too you're really in it. You realize how much power that is. I think we have so much untapped potential if we can maneuver and manage a lot of little things of. You know the whirlwind that goes on upstairs and what does it look like for Carrie to perform as the best version of herself every day.
Speaker 2:I love that question because I mean I have such a great answer. But like I've been working very diligently toward this answer, so and I've talked about this a couple of times I have in my sauna I have a like there's a piece of wood that goes down vertically and so I put actual post-it notes. Now they've I've upgraded to post. Actually, there was a client that made me um, she had her daughter make me, uh, laminated colored ones, so it looks a little bit better than that. Now, the top ones what I would do is I would visualize mentally they would be in my head. Now they're just there. So the top one is MF. Okay, and it's not motherfucker.
Speaker 3:It's my initials. Thanks, Carrie.
Speaker 2:Actually I'm soft launching my obsession with you. I just literally, it's what I think about every day.
Speaker 3:That's why you lit up when I asked that question.
Speaker 2:So it's me first, right. And so in in that first column is like OK, what does me first mean? It means being as healthy as I can be. Am I exercising? Am I trying to put good things in my body? Am I trying to keep habits at bay that I know I can have a propensity towards? What are the answers? And you stay, you stay with that. Just, you stay there in the MF and you start thinking those things through Am I doing a good job? Where do I need to be better? What do I need to be leaning into? Because I'm not going to perform the best I can for my kids, for my husband, for my circle, for the business or anything, if I'm not doing those things first. And so when you start to do this, this visualization, you start to then draw it in, right, so I know what the habits are, I know how many times I've worked out, and that just draws you back to okay, carrie, like we're doing great or we have some work to do.
Speaker 2:And then the second one below is I, I, I see, invest in, wait. I, I see, invest in your inner circle. So your inner circle is your family, you know, and then those close people around you. But that's after doing this like external audit, like who really are those close people around you? And that's a hard one to do because you may find yourself, you know, thinking so how are you investing in those people?
Speaker 2:So for me, right now, I have two young children and I have a husband. So it's like am I being present? What are we doing this summer? Let's go to Cedar Point, okay, make memories. Let's go to the lake. So you're literally reminding yourself, sitting watching this.
Speaker 2:I see you're like okay, these are my people. What have I done for this person? How do I invest in their emotional bank account? What can I do to surprise and delight that person? Really, like, just, these are the people.
Speaker 2:Everyone else's noise, whoever's made it on this list, what can I do? And I'm not saying every single day you're trying to figure out how to like, drop something off on somebody's door. You just know who these people are and over time, if you haven't really thought about that person for a while, okay, what's going on there? It could be a text message, it could be whatever. And then after IIC is BYE, build your empire, okay, and that one I can spend a lot of time on, and I know that's a flaw, and as I get older I'm like why are you spending so much fucking time here? Like that's one way to like kind of get yourself to stop, you know, because it's like okay, you can't spend all your time with the business stuff, so again, maybe the exercise that day is like skip that one because you're constantly thinking about that right.
Speaker 2:And then the last one is improve the atmosphere, ita. And so how is the Build your Empire? How is that aligning to the values, the purpose, the legacy I want to leave for my kids? You know, like this lemonade stand, for example. This lemonade stand, for me, has everything to do with what Dane is seeing and giving back and also being entrepreneurial. And then also the community. It's like we can do something so fun, it doesn't take that much heavy lifting, it feels so freaking good. And then for me to find a newer entrepreneur, like Zach and the Scatterjoy Project, I'm like, oh, I'm getting behind you all day long. So those are the four things. And then what's really powerful with this and I think we can all use a lesson from this if something doesn't belong in one of those four squares, get it the fuck out of your head, get it out, and that's the most. First, if it's not invest in your inner circle, if it's not build your empire and if it's not improving the atmosphere, it doesn't belong. Everything else is noise. Everything else is noise yeah.
Speaker 3:So you had empire in there, but do you? I feel like this is a full circle where, into the majority of that, at least the beginning of it, was the best version of Carrie, and I totally, wholeheartedly agree with this. It was family first, right, how did I show up best for my kids? But I'm also going back to these case studies, or whatever you want to call them, that you're doing with the B Lab, where you have the dreamer first, all the way up to someone at mountaintop getting burnout, stuck, whatever.
Speaker 3:I feel like they all could be encompassed in there too, right. Because especially with the dreamer and the startup is your mind is like I have to be everything to everyone. Everyone's a customer, everyone's a vendor. I have to be right. But it's like if you could just stay in that and it's not like we're have tunnel vision where I'm not willing to be expand and and and. When I come across an opportunity, take advantage of it. But I think, man, what great advice Do you see it that way too to pass on to some of the people in the B lab is like, if you stay in this, in these components, all the boxes get checked, everything's important, everything else is noise and you're going to grow this thing based on what's important to you.
Speaker 2:Well, so it's funny you say that because the so you have blocked which we talked about.
Speaker 2:And blocked is like kind of pre okay could be all mindset, but the real, the beginning, is the first prototype. It's called beginning and you just hit it on the head and it's a solo cast that I want to do soon, because if you're doing your job with someone in the beginning, the first thing we're talking about so, if somebody has the idea, if somebody has just started or they're getting ready to just start their business, the first thing we're going to talk about beyond like the alignment and the why you may already have, that is do best piece of business advice someone could have ever given me. I didn't get it early enough with SOS.
Speaker 2:When you are a beginning baby entrepreneur, you want everyone to like you. You want you think this product is or service is the most special thing. It is a child, it's a baby and that's what makes you good. But if a savvy business person who's been there can say to you you're going to make even more impact if you get laser focused on the person you are meant to serve, that is a complete game. It changes your whole trajectory or it saves you years of pain and effort and trying to.
Speaker 2:You know you want the demographic to be everyone and so if you're doing your job, helping someone in the beginning, that's one of the first things you talk about. The next thing you know, you're like holy shit, things could be so much easier. Because I don't want to serve dicks, I don't want to serve assholes, I don't give a shit about most of these people because they don't care about my product, my service. I want that like small pool of incredible people that I can actually make an impact with. And the next thing you know you're like oh my God, it's a completely different game.
Speaker 3:Well, and if I could add, you're going to confuse your audience, you're going to confuse your team. Who are we?
Speaker 3:Uh, rory Baden has this awesome analogy, talks exact speaks on exactly what you just said. Aim small, miss small. Right, if you are honed in, truly laser focus on your target audience, target goals, target reason, target communities. I mean. Everything else is, is, is, else, is outside of that circle. And it's funny, you're like this.
Speaker 3:20 years ago I might have listened to this, but I've had more than not a lot, but maybe a couple of people say, in the past six months, right, leading up to the launch and stuff, we're building up the technology and stuff. You know what you should do, michael, you should also team up with DoorDash and you could deliver people's groceries while you're on the way to their house with their laundry. And I'm like, yeah, now, 20 years ago you would have listened. The people pleaser would probably been like, oh really, they'll like me more and there's more revenue. No, that's not what we're serving, that's not what we're doing, right, but it kind of reminded me of what and what an awesome gift you can give to somebody in the beginning stage, because they don't have that experience to know that here's another gift for that person.
Speaker 2:Never listen to one, not one. I'm not even going to give an exception. You don't listen to one person who hasn't done something that you want to do. Everybody's well-intentioned right. So I'm going to go listen to uncle Joe, who thinks it's a good idea to have or marketing myopia where it's like no, it's like you. Listen to the people who have done what you want to do. Get yourself in rooms with those people, go to chat, gpt and figure out who the fuck those people are and just get really, really obsessed. That's what you do.
Speaker 3:Oh, it goes back to that mentorship community, right, like, go find them, yes, and if you find the true ones, they want to help you back. I mean they want to help you. You talk a lot in this platform about different subjects and I think the more we open up to others. But I think small business and entrepreneurs are supposed to look at like you have all the answers and I know what I'm doing and I just think you know someone's especially first starting out like look at that guy who started that company.
Speaker 3:you know your, your parents, friend or your neighbor, your uncle, and go ask him how they did it you know, and I believe that a really successful entrepreneur for doing it for the right reasons is begging you for to ask them, because they want to share with you their knowledge. They're proud of you for wanting to start something on your own, so they are just as eager to help you as you are eager to you know, you're thirsty for that knowledge.
Speaker 3:So I think you know reaching out and then going, finding other peers that are maybe in the same season. Right, maybe you're in the dreaming phase, maybe you're in the launch. Uh, maybe you're scaling or maybe you're, maybe you're mountaintopping, like I don't know what to do next. I think, just reaching out to other people who are, you know, in those same shoes and just start collaborating on what they're doing next or how they're getting through it. And I had some amazing conversations over the past 20 years with entrepreneurs who are in completely different spaces than I was. We had nothing in common, you know, as far as like the products or the services, but our problems were the same.
Speaker 2:Oh yeah, so in common, you know, as far as like the products or the services. But our problems were the same. Oh yeah, so say you got everything in common, yeah, except the widget. Yeah, except the widget. You know another thing in the beginning? Well, actually that's not true, it's not. It's not just beginning. So the, the build out too we're doing.
Speaker 2:I mean, you can have these lessons in in multiple of these prototypes. It depends on, like, what you know, what specific situation. But something that keeps coming up is pricing psychology, and I'm going to do a solo cast on that too, because I'm very passionate about it. Figuring out your pricing model is insane. It's like people are so they're sluts, we're sluts, we're insecure. It goes back to how you feel about you know yourself or what you would buy. It's like no, here's the best pricing advice I could possibly give anybody, just for the interest of time here Is, instead of looking at your product or your service and saying, okay, it costs me this, I'm going to add this onto it and I'm going to charge this, yep, right, what is the perceived value of your product or service?
Speaker 2:A lot of people don't have the confidence to think it's worth what it is. I mean, we talk in very, we go granular, yep, we talk psychology. We also have to remember like and so many entrepreneurs do this, because I experienced this with my previous company I would have arguments around apparel and what we would be charging for apparel, and I would get this back like well, I shop at Old Navy or I shop here. I would never pay like $78 for this hoodie. That isn't how you set up your pricing in your business. I don't give a shit how much you're going to spend.
Speaker 2:Going back to like who you're serving, what we just talked about in terms of like really focusing in who's that person, what are they spending? Cause I promise you like, unless you want to be in like a, you know like dollar tree type environment where you're like super cheap and you're doing it fine, but if you want a premium ish product, you know, like you don't I'm you have to figure out what is that person, how do they perceive your brand, what are they willing to spend on? And, by the way, I hate to like can I remind people, there are people like me out there who feel like if it's too cheap, I want to poke a hole in it, I want to pay a little bit more for it. So if you haven't, if you're an entrepreneur out there and you have not done sort of a deep dive on like the psychology of your pricing model, the why, like, where you're trying to fit in in the market, I highly recommend doing it.
Speaker 2:Unless things are going well and you've kind of figured it out, if things feel clunky and you're like shit, like I'm not making, like whether it's the B lab or somebody else, step back and like have those conversations and do that deep dive. There's nothing more important. It's how much money you're making per.
Speaker 3:Well, it's what? What's the market gonna? What's the where are they going to perceive? So I come back to this a lot in this example. I've had conversations with entrepreneurs about this. 15, maybe now 20 years ago, two dudes had this idea. I think we can make really nice coolers and sell them for $400. Yeah, right, like Yeti at the time are you kidding me? When, like, who was it Coleman? And like the little push neon buttons on the side and push for $40 at one, like you're going 10 X with that idea. And here we are today. Right, I'm heart first. Right, I feel like the fluff is what better way to serve people than cleaning their laundry?
Speaker 3:But when I knew, from a pure business standpoint and like the need when it comes to like the sale, I was in a hurry to go somewhere and I was leaving and 20 minutes before I leave, my son says dad, can you order me, jimmy John's? I say order you, jimmy John's, and before I was walking out the door it came, it was delivered, whatever, and I got the alert. I looked down and it was right, cause this whole thing was already like fresh in my brain. So a text or an alert that you normally don't look at, especially when you're kind of in a hurry. I looked down and the $8 sub was like $19.50. Why? Because it was convenient. Oh and, by the way, when I said I was in a hurry, I was going to get in my Uber. So it's like all these convenience factors come in right, like the market's going to pay what's convenient and I don't know.
Speaker 3:I always come back to that Jimmy John's story. It was at the right time at the right place. I'm like, oh, that's what we want to pay for. And back to your like, sell me on. You know, it's like time, what are? And I don't know. I think that's, you know, the 78 dollar sweatshirt, if it's a quality item and it's at a premium facility.
Speaker 2:Yeah, they're gonna look at it and go oh, this is carry shop, this is premium stuff here, yeah you know, I mean it's, and there's just so many things you're just so quick to want to like hurry up and do it and everyone and people, just they don't take the time to step back and really create a strategy or a philosophy around some of these things that would just save them. So, and that's what I want to do is like I want to help people either avoid landmines or, like you know, course correct yeah you don't have to stay doing it the way you're doing it.
Speaker 2:Because you are doing it that way, you know it's like you don't my biggest pet peeve.
Speaker 3:Why do you guys do something like that?
Speaker 2:because we've always done it.
Speaker 3:We do it this way because we've always done it.
Speaker 2:Like you know, I can't stand it and listen if it's working, if you can show me sure, if it's working, great. But like there are so many things that could just refine, finesse and guess what. Increase profitability, because that's the king profit. If you want to be more of a premium to, but you're kind of selling yourself, what have you done here? It's hard to recoup from that If you're constantly doing sales or you're constantly you're driving your like. Take a step back and like let's look at this thing and how can we make your life more profitable, more aligned, how can we make it better? You know, I think people have they're prideful, they don't know what they don't know they're, they're in the grind and they don't realize. Like you can't, when's the last time you've you've spent money on coaching for yourself or your business? That's one of the one of the top things you could possibly do for yourself. Whether you have a business or not, what kind of coaching or what kind of opportunities are out there for you for growth? You know like, spend some money on that.
Speaker 3:Open your eyes like widen your lens Blows my mind that in 2025, people think I'm crazy because I go to therapy every two weeks. What's are you okay? What's wrong? Nothing, maybe right. Maybe there's some days there are something, but it's like why can we go to the gym and look at our physical health and not take the same approach. Or mental health. We're doing check-ins, we're doing, hey, 30,000 feet, what do you see? Where's blind spots? How can I be better? Same with like a seminar or like coaching or business coaching. Yeah.
Speaker 2:Cause. You cause, I think, I think, a lot of people out there. If you're being really honest, you're holding really close to this baby that you've, that you've created, right, and you don't want anybody calling it ugly, yep. And so guess what I'm going to do? In a very loving way, I'm going to call it ugly. If there are things that are ugly, I'm also going to tell you the beautiful things about it. You know, but you got to get out of your own way, and that's another thing too.
Speaker 2:When you have built something for, let's say, a decade, and it is time if you do want to scale it, you know no one gives a fuck in another market what you're doing here. You could have a cult life like following and everybody loves you. Nobody knows you, and so you may have to do things. Now I'm not saying, lose the. You know the brand identity. Of course, brand is going to be that much more important, but you're going to have to do things like figure out how to sell it, how to like get beat through the door, how to create awareness again, going from zero in some of these markets, and so you have to change. You're like oh, we're so great, we're this really, because nobody knows who the fuck you are there. So how are you going to, how are you going to get those people to feel the way they feel here? It doesn't just happen.
Speaker 3:Well, it's a lot of hoping and wishing that I want my ugly baby to look like that or go do those things. Yeah. Well, the only way you're going to be able to do it is, you know, the work putting in the actions. Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2:I could talk about this all damn day. Well, you just can you tell.
Speaker 3:You said alignment. I'm like I could go on for an hour more about that.
Speaker 2:It's crazy. So I wish you nothing but the best of luck. I really feel good about this. I think your branding I'm a branding snob your branding I would give like nine and a half, if not more, out of 10. I was very impressed, like the color, I like the name, I just like everything you got going on. I like that you're willing to just, you know, roll up your sleeves, make it happen, and I just my prediction is pretty much in line with yours for you in the next five years, I think you're going to have a lot of trucks.
Speaker 2:Thank you A lot of trucks and thank you for coming in.
Speaker 3:Thanks for having me, Carrie.
Speaker 2:You're single I am.
Speaker 3:All right, here she goes.
Speaker 2:Hey, listen, there's a lot of angles here. You're single and ready to mingle. Hey, get it. Listen, ladies, get in before. He has about 100 trucks okay. This is what. I'm saying he's a one-truck man right now. So you know, timing is everything. Thank you, michael. Thanks, keri, and if you're still out there following your girl. Follow me on YouTube, spotify, apple or wherever you get your podcasts. And until next time, go to the Fluff app, get some laundry service, let me know how it goes, and keep moving baby.
